Meeting documents

The Chair, Councillor Andy Furse welcomed everyone to the meeting and explained the Panel's role in the consultation process for this review.

The Chair drew attention to the emergency evacuation procedure as set out on the Agenda.

Lyn Sammons declared a non-pecuniary interest as Chair of Governors at Wellsway school.

There was none.

Councillor Tony Crouch - Keynsham Town Council

Councillor Crouch thanked the Panel for the opportunity to present feedback from the Town Council. He queried the statistics that referred to the projected surplus places in Keynsham primary schools and reported that the Town Council were also concerned about the reliability of the birth rate statistics from the Primary Care Trust. He therefore urged the Council to exercise caution and allow flexibility when planning future school needs based on projections from these statistics. The Town Council valued and supported all the schools in Keynsham and were keen to see the diversity currently offered by the various schools continue. The School Organisation Manager re-assured Councillor Crouch that the process would proceed with caution and that the Council was aware of the dangers of relying on some types of statistics.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - Do you think that there is appropriate educational provision in Keynsham and is it fairly spread?

Councillor Crouch - It is questionable whether the schools are in the right places. The Church of England school will always attract a certain pupils and I am aware that there is a lot of cross-town movement between schools.

Panel - Are there many children attending Keynsham schools from neighbouring authorities and have the Town Council had any discussions with these authorities about this issue?

Councillor Crouch - I am not aware of much cross-border movement at primary level, but I know that there is a significant amount at secondary level. The Town Council have not discussed this issue with other authorities.

Councillor Reg Williams - Saltford Parish Council

Councillor Williams informed the meeting that the parish council were very concerned about the problems that Saltford children were experiencing in getting places at the village school - this particularly applied to older children moving in to the village. The governors at Saltford were seeking to increase the school by 2 classes in order to accommodate the demand for places. Councillor Williams expressed the hope that the proposed change to the admission policy for rural schools concerning the sibling link could be extended to urban schools.

Councillor Adrian Inker - Ward Councillor, Keynsham South

Councillor Inker explained that he serves as a school governor in Keynsham, but that on this occasion, he was speaking as a ward councillor.

He said that schools needed stability but it was clear that the status quo would not give that. The review process can often seem like a negative exercise, but he felt it was important to widen the vision to address community as well as educational needs and encourage a positive approach.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - Are you aware of pupils from Keynsham South attending Saltford School?

Councillor Inker - I am not aware of any, but I do know that there is a lot of movement between Keynsham schools in general. I think keeping that flexibility around parental choice is important. This should not just be seen as a money-saving exercise.

St John's Church of England Primary School - Mrs Dyson (Headteacher) and Mr E Nall (Chair of Governors)

Mrs Dyson explained that she was aware of the sensitivities over the release of the Review document (A Review of Primary Schools in the Keynsham Area - Verson 2) and understood the financial pressures at a national and local level. It was understood that funding of £2million was being provided for empty places at schools and that this could be used elsewhere. She believed that doing nothing is not an option although `children' and not `schools' should be the priority and the best educational provision possible should be provided in Keynsham and Saltford. The Review presents a good opportunity for generations of children.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - In your opinion, how adequate are the current sites for the needs of the Keynsham schools?

Mrs Dyson - I would echo the information in the Review document, some sites are reasonably adequate and some are not.

Panel - Why has the distribution of children around the various schools changed? Are you aware of demographic changes affecting the intake to your school?

Mrs Dyson - It is largely down to parental perception - I do not know why parents choose different schools.

Panel - Is there a connection between planned lower numbers at a school and the quality of education?

Mrs Dyson - This depends if the school was overcrowded to start with. If the pupil numbers drop then it can have a deteriorating effect because the resources will be used in maintaining a larger school than is required.

We must always look ahead, we have looked at our planned admission level because we knew the numbers would change. You can never sit back and assume things will always be the same, you must always expect numbers to change due to factors such as parental choice or new buildings at a particular school.

Mr Nall - I echo what has been said but from a parental point of view, the education of the children must be at the forefront of everything.

Castle Primary School - Mr Johnson (Headteacher) and Mr Maule (Chair of Governors)

Mr Maule asked some questions of the Panel and Education officers. He explained that there was a suspicion that this process was a sham and that the decisions had already been made, he also queried why three schools in particular were mentioned.

The Education Director and the Chair of the Panel made assurances that the decision had certainly not been made, there were options but no decisions at this stage. The Education officer explained that, in discussion some schools may be more vulnerable, but it was not in any way highlighting schools `at risk'.

Mr Maule referred to the plan to build houses in the area being dropped and the Panels view on what would happen if the Secretary of State overuled this. The Education officer explained that the draft Local Plan recognised that if 500 houses were built in the area then the developer would contribute to educational costs - however this was dropped from the Plan. Mr Maule asked about a reduction in a schools capacity and the fact that this means less funding and therefore means the school cannot keep on the same level of teaching staff. The Education officer explained that a reduction in a schools capacity would be linked to the level of pupils entering the school. If there are less children then there will be less spaces - it would not be the other way around.

Mr Johnson wished to draw the Panels attention to the fact that schools have huge peaks and troughs in numbers and it is hard to plan long term. Parental choice means that numbers can swing dramatically.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - Are the local birth rates accurate?

Mr Johnson - This is not the only factor, people move into the area or choose schools out of their area.

Panel - Do you think that significant levels of unfilled places across the area and the high level of unfilled places at particular schools represents an issue requiring attention?

Mr Maule - Yes this does need to be addressed.

Panel - In your opinion, how adequate are the current sites for the needs of the Keynsham schools?

Mr Johnson - Each school is unique in its provision, each school has their own identity.

Panel - What is your view on the possible new build in Keynsham?

Mr Johnson - I applaud this, Keynsham needs flexibility to provide wrap around care to communities, any extra resource would be positive. Some schools provide direct care to communities - a drop-in centre would be very welcome.

Chandag Junior School - Mrs A Creech (Head), Mrs B Sell (Chair of Governors), Charlotte Trigg & Dean Jefferies (Parent Governors)

Mrs Creech informed the Panel that one of the main reasons for people moving to the Keynsham area was because of the quality of the schools. She went on to explain to the Panel the reasons why Chandag Junior School's Net Capacity figure was at variance with numbers on roll and emphasised that the school was not taking places from other schools. The governors had recently decided to reduce the Planned Admission Level in each year group, so that they were able to take all of the intake from Chandag Infant School and also to ensure that children moving to the Chandag estate could attend their local school. Ultimately, this will save 28 of the surplus places at the school. Mrs Creech further explained to the Panel that, if their PAL was reduced to the Net Capacity figure of 240 then they would still have to keep 8 classes, but the subsequent reduction in funding would mean that they would lose staff. The Chandag schools were unique, with provision for 3-18 year olds on one site and with the increasing popularity of the area with young families, it would be unwise to reduce the intake numbers.

Mrs Sell informed the Panel that the school had been reviewed twice in the past 7 years. It would be good to have a new school as the infant and junior buildings were a long way apart which could be problematic if the schools were amalgamated without new buildings.

The School Organisation Manager informed the meeting that if a new school was built for the Chandag estate, it would most likely be on the present site. If the predicted demand could not be met by a 2-form entry school, then it might be preferable to keep the separate junior and infant schools.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - Do children attend your school who live in other parts of Keynsham?

Mrs Creech - Yes they do and they also come from South Gloucestershire and Saltford - parental choice is the key.

Panel - Are most of the older children who move into your school doing so in order to gain a place at Wellsway school?

Mrs Creech - We do find that people can afford houses on the estate when the children are older and then they move on to Wellsway. We try to accommodate movers wherever possible.

Dean Jefferies (parent governor)

Mr Jefferies informed the Panel that the Keynsham schools had an excellent reputation - he had moved from Bath in order for his children to take advantage of the education on offer in the town.

Chandag Infant School - Mrs Toy (Headteacher) and Mr Mead (Chair of Governors)

Mr Mead stated that there had been consultation on amalgamation 6 years ago and there was no support for it so why is there now further consultation. He also queried whether this exercise was purely cost saving.

Mrs Toy stated that she found this pre-amble process very useful. She asked that the matter be treated with sensitivity so that there was no divisiveness caused in the area as schools worked well together at present. Chandag is a successful site and parents often choose the school because it caters for 4-7 year olds.

The Education Director addressed the points made by Mr Mead and explained that in his job, the education of children must come first yet the resource issue could not be ignored. There will not be a situation where there are no surplus places - there will be a level of flexibility.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - Do any council employees put their children in Keynsham schools?

Mrs Toy - Yes, some people who work in Keynsham put their children in Keynsham schools so they can be near their children when they are young. They usually move into the area for the schools at a later date.

Panel - In your opinion, how adequate are the current sites for the needs of the Keynsham schools?

Mrs Toy - All the schools serve a purpose, I don't know the sites that well.

Panel - Do you think that significant levels of unfilled places across the area and the high level of unfilled places at particular schools represents an issue requiring attention?

Mrs Toy - I didn't realise that there were so many unfilled places, I do think this has to be addressed, there must be a better way to use the funds.

Keynsham Primary School - Mrs Woodman (acting Head), Rev. Vaughan Rees ( Chair of Governors) & Diane O'Brady (parent governor)

Mrs Woodman explained to the Panel that the school had been working creatively since the fall in numbers. They had a thriving nursery section with 60 places and a breakfast club. The school benefited from a pro-active governing body and friends association. In addition, using separate funding, they had built a quiet place where children could receive psychotherapy and have their learning needs addressed. These facilities could also be used for the wider community in the town. They also had plans to create a nurture unit where children with extreme needs could be helped.

Rev. Rees asked the Panel to recognise how much insecurity was generated by the review process in the school and community and to ensure that the process was as swift as possible. He was concerned that some of the conclusions in the report might lead to assumptions being made prematurely about the outcome

The School Organisation Manager explained that this review consultation was taking 12 weeks unlike the previous review which lasted 9 months, so the process had been accelerated. It was recognised that reviews were difficult for all the schools involved, but the Department for Education and Skills had advised that the publication of draft conclusions was helpful in order to facilitate forward planning. The officers acknowledged that the process had to be thorough, focussed and accurate.

Questions from the Panel

Panel - How does the new Neighbourhood nursery work with your own nursery?

Rev. Rees - They are different establishments. The school's nursery can only provide care for children up to 2.5 days per week whereas the Neighbourhood Nursery is a private, full-time facility. We would like to develop our nursery provision, but we are not sure about the future, given the falling intake numbers.

Panel - Why has the distribution of children around the various schools changed? Are you aware of demographic changes affecting the intake to your school?

Rev. Rees - I am not an expert in these matters. However, one of the factors may be the population profile of the local estate - the children of the original residents are older and so the primary numbers are falling.

Temple Primary - Adrienne Hughes (Headteacher) and representatives from the School

Adrienne Hughes made the following points in a statement - The need for aligning the provision of primary school places in the Keynsham area with likely future demand is understood. In facing hard choices ahead, it is asked that the Council consider the following when making the decision:

School popularity - Temple is an increasingly popular school for families moving into the area and parents moving their children to the school.

Standards - Temple is one of the top 20 schools in B&NES for KS2 results. The school has received a `Special Achievement Award'.

Broader Achievements - Temple has `Investors in People' and `Basic Skills Quality Mark' and regularly achieves sporting success locally.

School Environment & Community Context - Temple is the only school in the heart of Keynsham, it is well used by the community and the split site is used as an asset.

We would question some of the comments made in the Review document regarding some of the comments on suitability at Temple School.

The Education Officer commented on some of the issues raised regarding suitability of the site of the school. It was explained that the national document `Area Guidelines for Schools' was applied, issues such as no playing field is a major suitability issue.

The school representatives raised the following questions:

1. It is a fact that our school and a number of others in the cluster gain a number of pupils after the September count, often coming from outside the Authority, so is it not a mistake to base projections of future surplus places purely on local birth-rates?

The Education officer explained that in the course of a 12 week review, analysis of movement is not possible. Where pupils lived was looked at and 95% live in Keynsham and Saltford. At the review stage, the figures would be looked at a lot more closely. The Panel Chair stated that outcomes would not be based solely on PCT figures.

2. To test whether or not a school has the correct Planned Admission Number for its Net Capacity the PAN should be multiplied by the number of year groups in the school. There are two schools in Keynsham where the PAN X yr group multiplier is considerably larger than the school's Net Capacity. Shouldn't the PANs be changed to match Net Capacity?

The Education officer explained that the Planned Admission Number is higher at some schools, this reflects the Councils attempt to meet parental preference within reason.

Councillor Charles Gerrish, Ward Councillor - Keynsham North

Councillor Gerrish was concerned about the accuracy of the PCT figures as many Keynsham people accessed maternity healthcare in Bristol, not Bath. He also asked whether the neighbouring villages around Keynsham were included in the statistics. He further commented about the potential problems caused by a change in the population profile as the older residents on the council estates are replaced by young families.

There is no given catchment area in the Keynsham area so there is a lot of movement between schools. The current diversity of provision meets parental demand and the community would not want that eroded. The priority must be the quality of education for our children.

The School Organisation Manager informed Councillor Gerrish that the PCT data was based on postcodes and that the villages were included in the figures. All statistics on these matters show a consistent and clear decline in the birth rate - as evidenced by the fact that the numbers of children in all B&NES primary schools in the past 5 years has fallen by 400.

The Chair concluded the meeting by thanking everyone for their contributions.